08.04.2011 - Rising & Emergence

Arisia Vita: like compassion?
Arisia Vita: empathy?
Wol Euler: hello zen
Arisia Vita: love...
FcSeeker: Hello Zen
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Can we trust what "rises"? - - - what "emerges" in us?
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Yes, and survival again
Julie Bluebird (lolli.bluebird): Hi Zen :)
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Hey, Zen!
Wol Euler: mu.
FcSeeker: imo yes, but when ever something bad rises...hurtfull...there's a reason to ask 'why'
Wol Euler: (to bruce)
Zen (zen.arado): Hi all
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): That depends on you. Have your instincts been right?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): MU!
Wol Euler: Wol Euler smiles.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Bruce loves "Mu"! -- remembers Douglas Hoffsteader's GODE, ESCHER, BACH.
Wol Euler: yeo
Wol Euler: *yep
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Asking why is very helpful, it is how we learn from our mistakes
Wol Euler: that's where I heard of it first too
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): ;-)
Zen (zen.arado): has anything arisen yet ?
Zen (zen.arado): :)
FcSeeker: I would even claim, that when there's an instinc in a question, there's no questions left...but just to 'give up' to the idea we then have and follow it...
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Giving in to instinct, Fc?
FcSeeker: when you ask that for bad feeling, you can avoid a mistake...
FcSeeker: and learn without doing bad
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): A purely instinctive feeling made me avoid being caught up in a riot once.
FcSeeker: or avoiding your fear and do the good you might have been afraid to do
FcSeeker: <3
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Do we need to train our "discernment" to be able to tell instinct from wisdom-knowing?
Zen (zen.arado): can you distinguish between intuition and an emotion though?
Zen (zen.arado): yes agree Bruce
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Yes, Zen, that IS the question.
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Fc, we may be painting with too broad of a brush.
FcSeeker: that sure is possible
Zen (zen.arado): some think if they feel something it must be right
Zen (zen.arado): 'gut feeling'
Julie Bluebird (lolli.bluebird): As someone who isn't particularly socially competetive, what is jealousy's function
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Do you think that emotion ight come from instinct?
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): *might
Zen (zen.arado): I thnk emotins come from thoughts
Zen (zen.arado): the feeling n the body produced by thoughgts
Wol Euler: sorry, I have to slip away early. Take care, be happy
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Not very deep one, since we have seen animals display emotions
Zen (zen.arado): bye Wol
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Bye, Wol!
Julie Bluebird (lolli.bluebird): Bye Wol
Zen (zen.arado): hmmm yeh
FcSeeker: well; I'de have an example of such that cannot be based on thought just from yesterday....
Zen (zen.arado): wonder how deep their emotions are
Zen (zen.arado): yes FC?
FcSeeker: hm
FcSeeker: well
FcSeeker: that would be the story of quite many lines...
FcSeeker: are all quick to read ?
Zen (zen.arado): sure
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Bruce wants to read about Fc's insight.
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): we can always scroll
FcSeeker: o.k.
Zen (zen.arado): we can read faster than you type probably Fc:)
FcSeeker: it happened that my friend called me and asked me to go to the restaurant in which he was
FcSeeker: I had two items on my certain desk which I bought from Vatican many years ago
FcSeeker: immediately I closed the call the other of them items ...sorry but I dont know other way to express but that she started to 'tell me' that I need to take her with me because I shall meet a person to whom she belongs
FcSeeker: but that came as the feeling and with such glims of light wich I understood to be a feminine person
FcSeeker: so; after the feeling and that glims came the thoughts
FcSeeker: when I arrived to the restaurant, I saw my friend to have a couple with him beside the table
FcSeeker: seeing the girl I knew this item to belong to her
Zen (zen.arado): that is like some extra ability to me
FcSeeker: so I sat beside the table and gave that item to that girl
Zen (zen.arado): (sorry..thought you ha finished)
FcSeeker: ah; set it onto the table in front of her and just looked her to her eyes
FcSeeker: she looked back as surprised, and asked; "Is this for me ?"
FcSeeker: and I said 'yes'
FcSeeker: then she looked a moment and soon she said; "
FcSeeker: "I understand"
FcSeeker: her bf said that "I dont"
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): ;-)
FcSeeker: then my friend showed the ring on that bf's finger and told ; "I just gave that ring"
FcSeeker: and the young man lifted his t-shirt and showed how he had such kind of tattoo which form was in the ring also
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): (wow)
FcSeeker: my friend had seen this couple about two months ago
FcSeeker: I met them the first time
FcSeeker: we spent very nice evening with them and the young man learned a lot of such that he's never even heared about
FcSeeker: (trying to end the story...so much happened)
Julie Bluebird (lolli.bluebird): Interesting story Fc
Zen (zen.arado): yes
FcSeeker: well...feel need to add this;
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): This sounds like what the Hindus call "Sidhi powers" - -
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): http://www.mytelekinesis.com/siddhi-...eromaster.html
Zen (zen.arado): yeh some kind of power
FcSeeker: this girl is opened; enlightened, but the 'role' of the boy is to be her 'anchor'...that she wouldn't start to fly ...
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): I esperienced this when I first began meditating -- coulg predict earthquakes, and such.
Zen (zen.arado): oh? interesting
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): It sacred me enough that I quit doin it -- but also wanted to move on beyond those powers. . . (they can be a major distraction, I thought).
FcSeeker: <3
Arisia Vita: ty for sharing that with us Fc
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): But also quite helpful -- to inform you in ways to help others who might need it.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Yes, thank you for sharing that --!
Zen (zen.arado): wonder why we all don;t develop and use such powers
Zen (zen.arado): but remember a story of the Budddha
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Bruce listens intently.
FcSeeker: or many uses them the way that it's not noticed to be such...
FcSeeker: listens too
Zen (zen.arado): he came to a lake and a man showed him how he could walk across on the water
Zen (zen.arado): the buddha just said why? it is easier to just row across in a boat :)
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): ;-)
FcSeeker: thank you so much Zen for that story
FcSeeker: it's not so much reminded of Buddha how he was 'just a man'
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. . .
FcSeeker: which was the truth he would've liked to be remembered always
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): down to earth man.
Zen (zen.arado): maybe we couldn't manage such powers properly
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): So, is there something UNIQUE about certain intuitions that lets us know they they can be trusted?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): that they can be*
Zen (zen.arado): I think they can be a sudden coming together of pieces
Zen (zen.arado): so we aLREADY HAD ALL THE INGREDIENTS
Zen (zen.arado): sorry for caps
FcSeeker: how about 'you just know' ?
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): excuse me, brb
FcSeeker: that there is no questions
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): ok, Kirin.
Zen (zen.arado): yeh we just know somehow
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): There is a sort of Knowing (capital K) that sets the intuition off as unique, I feel.
Zen (zen.arado): beyond reason
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): I have had several of those -- life-changers, life- savers -- throughout my life.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): yes, it is not at all part of "reasoning."
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): discursive mind.
Zen (zen.arado): sometimes we might not even notice it?
Zen (zen.arado): but we have advanced
FcSeeker: the reason is that the feeling is based onto the Truth...
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Hmmmm.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): It feels like a "Conection" to something deeper -- as Zen says, a bringing together of the pieces.
Zen (zen.arado): or we notice it when e try to explain somethig we didn't understand before?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Connection*
FcSeeker: or act and see the 'resolt'...
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): IUt comes to me as a surprise... always.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): astonishing, usually.
Zen (zen.arado): so awakening is like that?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): perhaps, don't know.
FcSeeker: well...to me it's happened since my childhood, so I cannot much surprise anymore
Zen (zen.arado): maybe an uncovering of ideas that are buried
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): once in Berkeley, when i was still doing the Sidhi's," I suddenly got the "message " to GET OUT OF THE LANE I was traveling in on the freeway.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): And within second there appeared a stalled car in THAT lane -- that I would have run into at 70 mph and probably killed myself and others.
Zen (zen.arado): listens
Zen (zen.arado): wow
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Never will forget that "intuition."
FcSeeker: <3<3<3
Zen (zen.arado): maybe you have an angel Bruce
Zen (zen.arado): some believe that
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): But sometimes it is not quite that dramatic.
FcSeeker: think that not maybe, but yes
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): back
FcSeeker: wb Kirin
Zen (zen.arado): wb Kirin
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): A woman who reads auras says that I have a whole tribe of angels surrounding me. and I guess it must be so, or otherwise I would have been dead long ago.
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): ty Al
FcSeeker: I agree with her completely
Zen (zen.arado): I have a friend who can do that to
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): I do not see them or communicate with them, though.
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): all
FcSeeker: hm
FcSeeker: why not Bruce ?
Zen (zen.arado): actually she showed me how to do it too
FcSeeker: meaning communication
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): I just don't see them -- but apparently I can hear them when they need to break through my shell.
FcSeeker: <3
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): wow, Zen!
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Please say more.
Zen (zen.arado): you just look about six inches above the persons head in a room that isn't too bright
Zen (zen.arado): kinda let your eyes unfocus a bit
Zen (zen.arado): and there it was ...a violet aura
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): . . . . but seeing a whole tribe of Native-Americans surrounding me?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): that's what she saw.
Zen (zen.arado): around my friends head
Zen (zen.arado): ah no that's all I saw
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Yes, Zen, I can see those auras too. . . but this was forms of people. . .
Zen (zen.arado): perhaps with practice...
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): so, I really don't know what to think.
Zen (zen.arado): yoi could develop that power I am sure
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Yes, I have not really practiced to see them.
FcSeeker: there's so many reasons why somebody openes to see or hear, that there would be need to write huge much books to tell all
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Again, I veered away from the sidhi's when quite young.
FcSeeker: all are individuals and have own path
Zen (zen.arado): and 100 years from now they will have a scientific explanation for it
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): i feel that the auras are a "way of Knowing," though.
FcSeeker: I neither have ever practiced; all has always just come to me; whole my life
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): There is more and heaven and earth than are drempt of in your philosophy, Horatio. -- Hamlet.
FcSeeker: that is Burce so
Zen (zen.arado): maybe yo are more open than us Fc
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Does everyone else here know one another?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): no.
Zen (zen.arado): I have overlays of philosophical skepticism
Zen (zen.arado): yes Kirin
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): me too, Zen.. A lot of them.
FcSeeker: I can also be completely closed when it's not meant for me to see or sence other ways
Zen (zen.arado): nice to meet you if it is your first time
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Would you be good enough to explain 'Know"
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): layers of protection, Fc?
FcSeeker: the base reasons why not to are simple; the most high power is never meant to use to hurt of amusement
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Ways of Knowing is the name of this group, Kirin.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): So, that's why I used the phrase.
Zen (zen.arado): knowing people ...hmmm
Zen (zen.arado): might be a good topic for next week ?
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Oh I see. But you capitalise it, as if it were something different from the dictionary definitio
FcSeeker: well; the more open your are you are open to all; good and hurtfull
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): PMG -- Is the hour almost over already???
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): OMG.
Zen (zen.arado): true FC it has its downside too
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Well, the name of the group is also calitalized.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Ways of Knowing --- = WoK.
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): ok
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): ;-)
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): thank you
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Thanks for asking.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): I sort of assumed something that I should not have assumed.
Zen (zen.arado): originally the roup had a Buddhist teacher
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Zen, could you put into words the topic for next week that you have in mind?
Zen (zen.arado): group*
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): I see
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): That would make a difference
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Bruce wonders if that was "Stim."
Zen (zen.arado): http://waysofknowing.kira.org/
Zen (zen.arado): yes it was Bruce
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): I spent a whole week with Stim in Halifax in July. . .
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): with his typist, actually.
Zen (zen.arado): when can we say we 'know' someone
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): So -- TOPIC for next time?
Zen (zen.arado): what does that mean?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): When se say that we LNOW someone, what does that mean?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): OK!
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): KNOW*
Zen (zen.arado): something like that
Zen (zen.arado): /knowing me , knowing you'
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): REALLY a good thing for me to think about this week. . .
Zen (zen.arado): do we even know ourselves?
FcSeeker: so many various 'levels' how people think that they know somebody...
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): indeed, Fc.
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): Lets peel those layer away next week, OK?
Zen (zen.arado): can we really know someone in SL?
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): I must be away now.
FcSeeker: and when we find our 'limit', that goes more far because we have learned something and there's again new things to learn...
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): THANKS, everyone!
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Nice meeting you ,Bruce
Zen (zen.arado): would be interested in how you found it meeting peolle from SL in RL Bruce
FcSeeker: waves to Bruce
Arisia Vita: I must fly too....it was great being near you all
Julie Bluebird (lolli.bluebird): Thanks Bruce :)
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): THANKS, Kirin -- I hope you will come back next time.
Arisia Vita: be well and happy...
Bruce (bruce.mowbray): BFN!
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Take care , Arista
Zen (zen.arado): bye Lolli, Bruce, Ari
FcSeeker: takes a humble bow
FcSeeker: namaste all
Zen (zen.arado): bye Fc
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): hmmmm
Zen (zen.arado): quick exodus :)
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): I was hoping to meet some Taoists here
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): yes
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): But not surprising
Zen (zen.arado): I practicxe Zen
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): So much to do here
Zen (zen.arado): not much difference
Zen (zen.arado): I think Zen was an amalgamation of Buddhism and Taoism
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): I haven't looked into Zen, much, so I can't say
Zen (zen.arado): think you would find lots smilar
Zen (zen.arado): we get lots of variation here
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Please excuse me, I need to get supper on
Zen (zen.arado): sure
Kirin Winters (kirin.writer): Nice meeting you
Zen (zen.arado): you too